Comments for Visitors
Below are comments from individuals that have visited the site and have shared information about the boat and the builder. I appreciate the time people have taken to help fill in the blanks! I know you will find them interesting reading.
Korey writes....
Hi Rich,
I have 2 Liggett boat emblems that you may be interested in for your restoration of the American Lady. I found your website online. I found the emblems in my father in laws garage. He owned Chris craft antique boats in his lifetime and would collect parts from old boats that we're going to be scrapped at the marina where he kept his boat. I live in the Detroit area.
Hi Rich,
I have 2 Liggett boat emblems that you may be interested in for your restoration of the American Lady. I found your website online. I found the emblems in my father in laws garage. He owned Chris craft antique boats in his lifetime and would collect parts from old boats that we're going to be scrapped at the marina where he kept his boat. I live in the Detroit area.
Scott P writes.... (Scott sent a number of emails - listed below)
Hi Rich,
Congratulations once again on your ongoing restoration of the 40' Liggett cruiser. I am in the process of writing a book on the history of boat-building in Michigan and was working on the Liggett story when I came across your website. I think your best bet for an attempt to identify the original name and ownership of the boat will be Keith M. Steffke of Lincoln Park, Michigan at www.oldshipbuilder.com as he has been collecting information on Liggett and several other Detroit area and Downriver (south of Detroit) builders for many years, and he reportedly has Liggett company records. He is pretty protective of his source material but usually responds quickly to well-defined inquiries. I know he is building a bunch of models due June 1, so he may not be able to respond until after that time. Attached is the beginning of a hull list for Liggett that I have located in a few books and periodicals (embarrassingly short, sorry to say). Motor Boating magazine is available and searchable to an extent through Google Books now, so you might be able to check the 1925-1927 issues to see if a particular Liggett/DYC owner boat pops up.
Good luck with your project, and if I find anything else that might be helpful, I will try to send it your way. The only reason I thought Nahmid II might be your boat was that the listed build date was off by only a year from what you have on your site, and that the owner was a Detroit Yacht Club guy from the pennant.
Scott Peters
I forgot to mention that the name of the Alex McLeod boat you mention on the website is probably Frances A. VI, as appears in Motor Boating, October 1925, pp. 114 and 136 as running in the Kermath-powered boat race at Detroit for that year. The same issue also has the Sallan trophy race results for that year, which might rule out some boats as they don't fit your boat's date criteria. I don't know why his boat does not appear in the 1926 or 1927 races, but it is also a good candidate name for your boat as he was a very prominent Detroit yachtsman.
Some other possible search strategies for you to consider might be to do a lookup of Kermath advertisements or even a catalog in 1926 or 1927 to see if the boat appears with a name in one of those. The engine companies often ran photos of their newest deliveries with the boats they went into. You might also want to contact the Dossin Great Lakes Museum on Belle Isle in Detroit to see if they have a photo of the boat if you have not already done so, or even the Historical Collections of the Great Lakes at Bowling Green State University in Ohio (they also have an on-line database where you might be able to look up Liggett under "builder").
Keep up the great work, and if I come up with anything I will let you know ASAP.
Scott Peters
Hi Rich,
I am in the process of writing a book on the general history of boat-building in Michigan and was working a little on the Liggett story when I ran across your website and your boat. I think your best contact for figuring out the ownership of the boat might be Keith Steffke, who has been collecting information in massive volumes on many of the Detroit area builders for decades. He is a model builder, and here is a link to his website:
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/keith-m-steffke/28/36a/892
Hi Rich,
I took a few minutes and listed the boats the boats in the Detroit Regatta's Sallan Trophy race for cruisers in 1926 and compared it to the Cruisers with Kermath Engines Race in the Detroit Regatta's 1927 event. Attached is a list of the boats and their owners from both races, which I compared, based on your boat's presumed date of build and its Kermath power plant. It might reduce your search list to about seven boats, given that the two races were held in Detroit and DYC members participated in large numbers. Note that Namid III (not II like I suggested earlier) is owned by John B. Farr, president of Kermath, and also located in Detroit.
The Detroit Yacht Club should at least have a yearbook for 1926 or 1927, and they also produced a magazine named "The Main Sheet", which undoubtedly might also have photos of some of the boats to help with the process of elimination. Failing that, it someone in your area has access to a Lloyd's Register of American Yachts for 1927-1930, they list the builders of the boats and owners, which would also help narrow the list considerably.
I hope this helps in the possible identification of your boat, and good luck with the restoration!
Scott Peters
Michigan Historical Museum
Sallan Trophy Contestants, listed in Motor Boating, October 1926, p. 142
Name of Boat Owner
Liggett 34 A. C. Liggett Liggett, but too short
Escapade H. R. Esling
Del-Mar-Lu Chas. H. Koerber
Betty-Win III L. W. Forrester
Cindula Leo O. Nye
Wags II Adolph Wagner
Bo-Peep II Ivan M. Kirlin Defoe Boat & Motor Works
Commodore A. A. Schantz
Namid III John B. Farr Liggett?
Jean A Wilbur Adams
Chental Chas. Sorensen
Francis S. P. W. Seiler
Matthews 38 II S. C. Matthews Matthews Boat Co.
Betty Win II L. W. Forrester
Edith C. Howard E. Blood
Anna H. Frank P. Hess
Whim H. A. Parshall
Matthews 38-1 S. C. Matthews Matthews Boat Co.
Le Bobette Mark R. Hanna
Rob-E-Lo R. E. Linn
Ebco Vincent Link
Bobolink Harry A. Eberts
Lyola Murphy Bros.
Dauntless Fred W. Pearce
Caroline E. Dr. Conley
Corsair G. A. Hallman
Race for Cruisers Powered with Kermath Motors, Detroit Regatta, 1927, Motor Boating, October 1927, p. 132.
Flicker Fred Ford
Namid III Jack Farr
Albermu A. D. Thomas
Dauntless Fred Pearce
Del-Mar-Lu C. Koerber
Sapphire C. E. Jopel
Wag II A. B. Wagner
Betty-Win II R. A. DeVlieg
Loyola M. J. Murphy
Sumel M. A. Hollingshead
Molly-O Milton Myers
Caroline E. Dr. Conley
Hi Rich,
I am in the process of writing a book on the general history of boat-building in Michigan and was working a little on the Liggett story when I ran across your website and your boat. I think your best contact for figuring out the ownership of the boat might be Keith Steffke, who has been collecting information in massive volumes on many of the Detroit area builders for decades. He is a model builder, and here is a link to his website:
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/keith-m-steffke/28/36a/892
A bit more on Liggett from other sources: Alfred G. Liggett
A. G. Liggett & Son Company
Liggett Boat Works
Alfred G. Liggett was a boat builder in Detroit, Wayne County, by1909, although an older account places its start in 1899. His shop was initially located at 322 Hibbard. Another address for the same year was Park Place at the foot of Parkview Avenue. Liggett lived at 355 Holcomb Avenue. His son Louis G. Liggett worked as an engraver and boarded at the same residence in 1909. Early products of the firm included naphtha launches and large sailboats, both of which gained a reputation for being rugged and sturdy in stormy weather.
By 1911 the shop was located on the south side of Jefferson Avenue at the foot of Parkview Avenue, probably near the Bosserdet Yacht & Engine Company. The address by 1913 was listed as being at the foot of Motor Boat Lane. By 1919, Liggett's son Louis G. Liggett joined the firm and the company was renamed A. G. Liggett & Son Company, still located at the foot of Motor Boat Lane.
Growth came rapidly for the firm. By 1923, the company had relocated to Wyandotte Heights (later named Riverview), 1-1/2 miles from Wyandotte, and incorporated itself. Alfred G. Liggett was president of the firm; Elizabeth E. Liggett, vice-president; and Lewis [sp?] G. Liggett was secretary and treasurer. The company was located on W. Jefferson Avenue. By 1927, Elizabeth Liggett was no longer listed among the company's management, and the community address was identified as Sibley at that time. The company specialized in building larger [stock?] cruisers, which slept up to eight people and included a galley, shower bath and toilet, adequate lockers to hang up suits and dresses, and a roomy bridge deck. In 1931 the company was listed as A. G. Liggett & Son Company; with Alfred G. Liggett as president and Louis G. Liggett as secretary and treasurer; boat builders and marine railways. A separate entry stated that they operated a dry dock. The address was stated as the foot of Sibley Road.
By 1940, the firm was known as Liggett Boat Works with its address listed as being on W. Jefferson in Wyandotte. In 1950 its address was listed at 2965 Riverside in Trenton. Lou Liggett was the owner of the firm in 1955. In 1960 the ownership of the firm consisted of Lou Liggett and John Mather as a partnership.
They appear to have lasted until about 1963
Sources:
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1909-1910 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1909.) pp. 647, 2318.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Detroit City Directory, 1909 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1909.) pp. 1409, 2825.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1911-1912 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1911.) pp. 638, 2167.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1913-1914 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1913.) pp. 553, 1839.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1915 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1915.) pp. 552, 1852.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1917 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1917.) pp. 549, 2022
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1919-1920 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1919.) pp. 552, 1940.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1923-1924 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1923.) pp. 1400, 2002.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1925-1926 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1925.) pp. 1364, 1956-1957.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1927-1928 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1927.) pp. 1323, 2005.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1931-1932 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1931.) pp. 1155, 1649, 1832.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers--1940, No. 2, March, 1940 (Detroit: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1940.) p. 375.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers--1944, No. 3, June, 1944 (Detroit: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1944.) p. 416.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1946 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1946.) pp. 33, 158.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1950-1951 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1950.) p. 11--classified products section. p. 209-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1953 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1952.) p. 295--classified products section. p. 230-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1955 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1954.) p. 365--classified products section. p. 283-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1957 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1956.) p. 390--classified products section. p. 307-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1959 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1958.) p. 401--classified products section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1960 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1960.) p. 410--classified products section. p. 312-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1963 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1962.) p. 398--classified products section.
Kelly, Chester Dorman. "Boat Builders for the World." The Magazine of Michigan, Vol. 2, Nos. 5-6, May-June 1930. p. 28.
A. G. Liggett's brother founded the Rexall pharmacy store chain (need sources.)
Best wishes,
Scott Peters
Greg from Ann Arbor, Michigan writes.....
My family had a 40' Liggett built 1928, named Carmyn. We owned it 1974-78, when I was 12-16 years old. It was clearly a sistership to American Lady. I still have one DYC locker ventilator, just like yours. I visited Lou Liggett at his home on Gross Isle in the Detroit River around 1976. He had plenty of photos. Carmyn had a 200-hp Kermath engine, that died in its 50th year. The boat was destroyed at Toledo Beach Marina, near Monroe, MI, in 1980.
When my dad bought our boat in 1974, the center deck area had been enclosed. I have no idea when that happened. Over the winter of 1975-1976 we renovated it, and opened up the center deck again. The attached photo shows my dad playing the electric organ (we put that aboard) in the center deck area before we removed the enclosure. The second photo is a drawing on my wall that shows what the boat looked like after we removed the center deck enclosure.
I will send you more pictures of our boat the Carmyn, when I can get them from my mom and scan them.
When we bought our boat in 1974, the previous owner told us it dated from 1930. But two years later we had done a lot of work on it, and we put the year "1930" on the false window on the aft trunk cabin, and when the previous owner saw that and realized that we thought it's age was a GOOD thing, he told us it was actually from 1928. So we changed the date on the trunk cabin. I tend to believe that it actually dated from 1928, because it had a 200-hp Kermath engine. I understand that earlier models had a 65-hp Kermath, which some owners thought was underpowered, so it makes sense that by 1928 they were installing the 200-hp version. The trend of owners wanting more power continues today.
When we first bought the boat, there was no seat on the stern. There also was no railing around the stern, but looking at your pictures of Liggetts when they were new, I have no doubt that our boat must have had a railing there originally. But I could see no evidence of it by 1974.
There was one large DYC ventilator on the locker door in the aft head which I still have (see photo), and like yours, there were 2 smaller ones on the lockers ahead of the forward berths.
The third photo attached shows the compass, which was not original but actually came off a military aircraft. I have no idea when it had been installed.
I would love to see your boat sometime. I've already put in plenty of hours restoring a Liggett in the 1970's. It looks like you're going to do a great job, but I don’t envy you the task!
Greg Dodd
Ann Arbor, MI
Naila Writes....
I recall Lou a bit-he lived on the canal, about 1/2 mile north of us on Grosse Ile. I would sit with his wife when he had to do things and she was feeble.
He gave Pop the screw hoist from the works when they tore it down. It lived in back of the pop's shop waiting for pop to repair our dock (blown apart in 1974 when they blew the ice dam and ice tore apart both our lifts, the boat house for my brothers boat, the dock and about 20 feet of where the stairs went down to the river) until I gave i to Nick Manns when he rebuilt our garage in 1992. That and perhaps defunct neptune engines? I cannot recall now. I SEEM to recall somebody from the Trenton Police collected Liggett things-they or fire guys may know who has any engineering things. Lou gave his models to U of M naval arch school. They may have other Liggett things. They MAY have this one in their collection but I think that was the commercial stuff that had models. Not small craft. But that is the closest and probably best information source if you need it
Department Contact Information
* Phone: (734) 764-6470
* Fax: (734) 936-8820
* mail: [email protected]
* Mailing Address:
The University of Michigan
Naval Architecture and Marine Engineering
222 NAME Building
2600 Draper Dr.
Ann Arbor, Michigan 48109-2145
My brother George may recall more-but the folks with direct memory are all gone now-Pop(George Caruso), Mr. Mullias, old Mr. Manns etc.. There MAY still be one or two older Power Squadron folks left Some may still be available either through Ford or GI YC-I forward web sites..
http://www.usps.org/localusps/grosseile/history.shtml
http://www.fordyachtclub.com/Directory/directory.html
http://www.giyc.com/contact.htm
Manns is still the hardware store opposite where the boat works were in Trenton, Mi. The family is still there. Here is their site and some are older than I. Nick was into boats and never moved away.
http://www.namans.com/history.shtml
Oh-WATCH that bottom paint. Illegal and toxic-I had to haz mat stuff from the shop when we tore down and rebuilt the garage and refit the house to rent. I highly doubt you CAN purchase the lead arsenic stuff now.
[email protected] is my brother George, now in Fort Washington -DC area and still highly into boats.
When you get it up and running he would probably get a blast seeing it.
Good Luck with this.
Hi Rich,
Congratulations once again on your ongoing restoration of the 40' Liggett cruiser. I am in the process of writing a book on the history of boat-building in Michigan and was working on the Liggett story when I came across your website. I think your best bet for an attempt to identify the original name and ownership of the boat will be Keith M. Steffke of Lincoln Park, Michigan at www.oldshipbuilder.com as he has been collecting information on Liggett and several other Detroit area and Downriver (south of Detroit) builders for many years, and he reportedly has Liggett company records. He is pretty protective of his source material but usually responds quickly to well-defined inquiries. I know he is building a bunch of models due June 1, so he may not be able to respond until after that time. Attached is the beginning of a hull list for Liggett that I have located in a few books and periodicals (embarrassingly short, sorry to say). Motor Boating magazine is available and searchable to an extent through Google Books now, so you might be able to check the 1925-1927 issues to see if a particular Liggett/DYC owner boat pops up.
Good luck with your project, and if I find anything else that might be helpful, I will try to send it your way. The only reason I thought Nahmid II might be your boat was that the listed build date was off by only a year from what you have on your site, and that the owner was a Detroit Yacht Club guy from the pennant.
Scott Peters
I forgot to mention that the name of the Alex McLeod boat you mention on the website is probably Frances A. VI, as appears in Motor Boating, October 1925, pp. 114 and 136 as running in the Kermath-powered boat race at Detroit for that year. The same issue also has the Sallan trophy race results for that year, which might rule out some boats as they don't fit your boat's date criteria. I don't know why his boat does not appear in the 1926 or 1927 races, but it is also a good candidate name for your boat as he was a very prominent Detroit yachtsman.
Some other possible search strategies for you to consider might be to do a lookup of Kermath advertisements or even a catalog in 1926 or 1927 to see if the boat appears with a name in one of those. The engine companies often ran photos of their newest deliveries with the boats they went into. You might also want to contact the Dossin Great Lakes Museum on Belle Isle in Detroit to see if they have a photo of the boat if you have not already done so, or even the Historical Collections of the Great Lakes at Bowling Green State University in Ohio (they also have an on-line database where you might be able to look up Liggett under "builder").
Keep up the great work, and if I come up with anything I will let you know ASAP.
Scott Peters
Hi Rich,
I am in the process of writing a book on the general history of boat-building in Michigan and was working a little on the Liggett story when I ran across your website and your boat. I think your best contact for figuring out the ownership of the boat might be Keith Steffke, who has been collecting information in massive volumes on many of the Detroit area builders for decades. He is a model builder, and here is a link to his website:
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/keith-m-steffke/28/36a/892
Hi Rich,
I took a few minutes and listed the boats the boats in the Detroit Regatta's Sallan Trophy race for cruisers in 1926 and compared it to the Cruisers with Kermath Engines Race in the Detroit Regatta's 1927 event. Attached is a list of the boats and their owners from both races, which I compared, based on your boat's presumed date of build and its Kermath power plant. It might reduce your search list to about seven boats, given that the two races were held in Detroit and DYC members participated in large numbers. Note that Namid III (not II like I suggested earlier) is owned by John B. Farr, president of Kermath, and also located in Detroit.
The Detroit Yacht Club should at least have a yearbook for 1926 or 1927, and they also produced a magazine named "The Main Sheet", which undoubtedly might also have photos of some of the boats to help with the process of elimination. Failing that, it someone in your area has access to a Lloyd's Register of American Yachts for 1927-1930, they list the builders of the boats and owners, which would also help narrow the list considerably.
I hope this helps in the possible identification of your boat, and good luck with the restoration!
Scott Peters
Michigan Historical Museum
Sallan Trophy Contestants, listed in Motor Boating, October 1926, p. 142
Name of Boat Owner
Liggett 34 A. C. Liggett Liggett, but too short
Escapade H. R. Esling
Del-Mar-Lu Chas. H. Koerber
Betty-Win III L. W. Forrester
Cindula Leo O. Nye
Wags II Adolph Wagner
Bo-Peep II Ivan M. Kirlin Defoe Boat & Motor Works
Commodore A. A. Schantz
Namid III John B. Farr Liggett?
Jean A Wilbur Adams
Chental Chas. Sorensen
Francis S. P. W. Seiler
Matthews 38 II S. C. Matthews Matthews Boat Co.
Betty Win II L. W. Forrester
Edith C. Howard E. Blood
Anna H. Frank P. Hess
Whim H. A. Parshall
Matthews 38-1 S. C. Matthews Matthews Boat Co.
Le Bobette Mark R. Hanna
Rob-E-Lo R. E. Linn
Ebco Vincent Link
Bobolink Harry A. Eberts
Lyola Murphy Bros.
Dauntless Fred W. Pearce
Caroline E. Dr. Conley
Corsair G. A. Hallman
Race for Cruisers Powered with Kermath Motors, Detroit Regatta, 1927, Motor Boating, October 1927, p. 132.
Flicker Fred Ford
Namid III Jack Farr
Albermu A. D. Thomas
Dauntless Fred Pearce
Del-Mar-Lu C. Koerber
Sapphire C. E. Jopel
Wag II A. B. Wagner
Betty-Win II R. A. DeVlieg
Loyola M. J. Murphy
Sumel M. A. Hollingshead
Molly-O Milton Myers
Caroline E. Dr. Conley
Hi Rich,
I am in the process of writing a book on the general history of boat-building in Michigan and was working a little on the Liggett story when I ran across your website and your boat. I think your best contact for figuring out the ownership of the boat might be Keith Steffke, who has been collecting information in massive volumes on many of the Detroit area builders for decades. He is a model builder, and here is a link to his website:
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/keith-m-steffke/28/36a/892
A bit more on Liggett from other sources: Alfred G. Liggett
A. G. Liggett & Son Company
Liggett Boat Works
Alfred G. Liggett was a boat builder in Detroit, Wayne County, by1909, although an older account places its start in 1899. His shop was initially located at 322 Hibbard. Another address for the same year was Park Place at the foot of Parkview Avenue. Liggett lived at 355 Holcomb Avenue. His son Louis G. Liggett worked as an engraver and boarded at the same residence in 1909. Early products of the firm included naphtha launches and large sailboats, both of which gained a reputation for being rugged and sturdy in stormy weather.
By 1911 the shop was located on the south side of Jefferson Avenue at the foot of Parkview Avenue, probably near the Bosserdet Yacht & Engine Company. The address by 1913 was listed as being at the foot of Motor Boat Lane. By 1919, Liggett's son Louis G. Liggett joined the firm and the company was renamed A. G. Liggett & Son Company, still located at the foot of Motor Boat Lane.
Growth came rapidly for the firm. By 1923, the company had relocated to Wyandotte Heights (later named Riverview), 1-1/2 miles from Wyandotte, and incorporated itself. Alfred G. Liggett was president of the firm; Elizabeth E. Liggett, vice-president; and Lewis [sp?] G. Liggett was secretary and treasurer. The company was located on W. Jefferson Avenue. By 1927, Elizabeth Liggett was no longer listed among the company's management, and the community address was identified as Sibley at that time. The company specialized in building larger [stock?] cruisers, which slept up to eight people and included a galley, shower bath and toilet, adequate lockers to hang up suits and dresses, and a roomy bridge deck. In 1931 the company was listed as A. G. Liggett & Son Company; with Alfred G. Liggett as president and Louis G. Liggett as secretary and treasurer; boat builders and marine railways. A separate entry stated that they operated a dry dock. The address was stated as the foot of Sibley Road.
By 1940, the firm was known as Liggett Boat Works with its address listed as being on W. Jefferson in Wyandotte. In 1950 its address was listed at 2965 Riverside in Trenton. Lou Liggett was the owner of the firm in 1955. In 1960 the ownership of the firm consisted of Lou Liggett and John Mather as a partnership.
They appear to have lasted until about 1963
Sources:
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1909-1910 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1909.) pp. 647, 2318.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Detroit City Directory, 1909 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1909.) pp. 1409, 2825.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1911-1912 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1911.) pp. 638, 2167.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1913-1914 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1913.) pp. 553, 1839.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1915 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1915.) pp. 552, 1852.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1917 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1917.) pp. 549, 2022
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1919-1920 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1919.) pp. 552, 1940.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1923-1924 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1923.) pp. 1400, 2002.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1925-1926 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1925.) pp. 1364, 1956-1957.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1927-1928 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1927.) pp. 1323, 2005.
Polk, R. L. & Co. Michigan State Gazetteer and Business Directory, 1931-1932 (Detroit, MI: R. L. Polk & Co., 1931.) pp. 1155, 1649, 1832.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers--1940, No. 2, March, 1940 (Detroit: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1940.) p. 375.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers--1944, No. 3, June, 1944 (Detroit: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1944.) p. 416.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1946 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1946.) pp. 33, 158.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1950-1951 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1950.) p. 11--classified products section. p. 209-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1953 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1952.) p. 295--classified products section. p. 230-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1955 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1954.) p. 365--classified products section. p. 283-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1957 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1956.) p. 390--classified products section. p. 307-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1959 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1958.) p. 401--classified products section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1960 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1960.) p. 410--classified products section. p. 312-geographic section.
Michigan Manufacturer and Financial Record. The Directory of Michigan Manufacturers, 1963 (Detroit, MI: Manufacturer Publishing Co., 1962.) p. 398--classified products section.
Kelly, Chester Dorman. "Boat Builders for the World." The Magazine of Michigan, Vol. 2, Nos. 5-6, May-June 1930. p. 28.
A. G. Liggett's brother founded the Rexall pharmacy store chain (need sources.)
Best wishes,
Scott Peters
Greg from Ann Arbor, Michigan writes.....
My family had a 40' Liggett built 1928, named Carmyn. We owned it 1974-78, when I was 12-16 years old. It was clearly a sistership to American Lady. I still have one DYC locker ventilator, just like yours. I visited Lou Liggett at his home on Gross Isle in the Detroit River around 1976. He had plenty of photos. Carmyn had a 200-hp Kermath engine, that died in its 50th year. The boat was destroyed at Toledo Beach Marina, near Monroe, MI, in 1980.
When my dad bought our boat in 1974, the center deck area had been enclosed. I have no idea when that happened. Over the winter of 1975-1976 we renovated it, and opened up the center deck again. The attached photo shows my dad playing the electric organ (we put that aboard) in the center deck area before we removed the enclosure. The second photo is a drawing on my wall that shows what the boat looked like after we removed the center deck enclosure.
I will send you more pictures of our boat the Carmyn, when I can get them from my mom and scan them.
When we bought our boat in 1974, the previous owner told us it dated from 1930. But two years later we had done a lot of work on it, and we put the year "1930" on the false window on the aft trunk cabin, and when the previous owner saw that and realized that we thought it's age was a GOOD thing, he told us it was actually from 1928. So we changed the date on the trunk cabin. I tend to believe that it actually dated from 1928, because it had a 200-hp Kermath engine. I understand that earlier models had a 65-hp Kermath, which some owners thought was underpowered, so it makes sense that by 1928 they were installing the 200-hp version. The trend of owners wanting more power continues today.
When we first bought the boat, there was no seat on the stern. There also was no railing around the stern, but looking at your pictures of Liggetts when they were new, I have no doubt that our boat must have had a railing there originally. But I could see no evidence of it by 1974.
There was one large DYC ventilator on the locker door in the aft head which I still have (see photo), and like yours, there were 2 smaller ones on the lockers ahead of the forward berths.
The third photo attached shows the compass, which was not original but actually came off a military aircraft. I have no idea when it had been installed.
I would love to see your boat sometime. I've already put in plenty of hours restoring a Liggett in the 1970's. It looks like you're going to do a great job, but I don’t envy you the task!
Greg Dodd
Ann Arbor, MI
Naila Writes....
I recall Lou a bit-he lived on the canal, about 1/2 mile north of us on Grosse Ile. I would sit with his wife when he had to do things and she was feeble.
He gave Pop the screw hoist from the works when they tore it down. It lived in back of the pop's shop waiting for pop to repair our dock (blown apart in 1974 when they blew the ice dam and ice tore apart both our lifts, the boat house for my brothers boat, the dock and about 20 feet of where the stairs went down to the river) until I gave i to Nick Manns when he rebuilt our garage in 1992. That and perhaps defunct neptune engines? I cannot recall now. I SEEM to recall somebody from the Trenton Police collected Liggett things-they or fire guys may know who has any engineering things. Lou gave his models to U of M naval arch school. They may have other Liggett things. They MAY have this one in their collection but I think that was the commercial stuff that had models. Not small craft. But that is the closest and probably best information source if you need it
Department Contact Information
* Phone: (734) 764-6470
* Fax: (734) 936-8820
* mail: [email protected]
* Mailing Address:
The University of Michigan
Naval Architecture and Marine Engineering
222 NAME Building
2600 Draper Dr.
Ann Arbor, Michigan 48109-2145
My brother George may recall more-but the folks with direct memory are all gone now-Pop(George Caruso), Mr. Mullias, old Mr. Manns etc.. There MAY still be one or two older Power Squadron folks left Some may still be available either through Ford or GI YC-I forward web sites..
http://www.usps.org/localusps/grosseile/history.shtml
http://www.fordyachtclub.com/Directory/directory.html
http://www.giyc.com/contact.htm
Manns is still the hardware store opposite where the boat works were in Trenton, Mi. The family is still there. Here is their site and some are older than I. Nick was into boats and never moved away.
http://www.namans.com/history.shtml
Oh-WATCH that bottom paint. Illegal and toxic-I had to haz mat stuff from the shop when we tore down and rebuilt the garage and refit the house to rent. I highly doubt you CAN purchase the lead arsenic stuff now.
[email protected] is my brother George, now in Fort Washington -DC area and still highly into boats.
When you get it up and running he would probably get a blast seeing it.
Good Luck with this.